Another shot to the foot

The great question as Arizona seems headed into its next phase of destruction is: How could they vote for Jan Brewer? How could they vote for the same bunch of Kooks in the Legislature, with the same policies, that have already caused so much damage in the Grand Canyon State? It is a thundering question for the nation, as well. How could so many people be willing to return to power the party and philosophy that gave is the Lost Decade of the Bush years (stagnant stock market, falling living standards, record income inequality, rising deficit and the greatest economic crash since the Great Depression)?

For Arizona, the answers seem painfully obvious: The long incubation of right-wing philosophy seeded by Barry Goldwater but returned in a whirlwind of nihilism, hatred and God-guns-gays gasbaggery that Barry would despise. The Big Sort that has drawn like-minded people there in a surprising cluster for such a populous state (Washington, of similar population, is much more diverse politically). The fierce political activism and reliability of the neo-Birchers, paranoiacs, racists, proto-fascists and Mormons that decides elections where turnout it low. The civic detachment of a state where many residents don't consider it "home" and resort-apathy is rampant. The "What's the Matter With Kansas" mentality of working-class whites consistently voting against their economic interests. And the campesino mindset of the Mexican-American population that doesn't vote, even though its very existence is threatened by the Kookocracy.

But Jan Brewer? Is this the level of idiocy to which my home state has sunk? Roman Hruska, a forgotten Nebraska senator, defended a Nixon Supreme Court nominee by saying, "Even if he were mediocre, there are a lot of mediocre judges and people and lawyers. They are entitled to a little representation, aren't they, and a little chance? We can't have all Brandeises, Frankfurters and Cardozos." I suppose the idiots of Arizona deserve the representation of Jan Brewer. And she came along at the right time: When  the white-right was ginning up its anti-immigrant hysteria.

Even though the conservative and even fascist movement has deep roots in Arizona, the likely outcome of this election shows how much the state has changed. At one time, Terry Goddard — moderate Democrat with a long record of real accomplishment, including successfully fighting border crime — would have been elected by a wide margin. Think Raul Castro and Bruce Babbitt. Indeed, before the great wave of migrants from the Midwest, Arizona was a reliably Democratic state. Yet even after the Goldwater triumphs, it remained a healthy two-party state from the 1960s through the 1980s. Republican House leader Burt Barr and Democratic Senate leader Alfredo Gutierrez were close allies in working for the good of the state (and had a father-son-like relationship personally). That wouldn't be possible today.

We'll look back on the 1990s as a time of great damage in Arizona. Forty percent population growth. The loss of the last great agricultural areas around Phoenix. The rise of "master planned communities" and other abortions in the face of no planning. The destruction of locally headquartered companies such as Dial and Valley National Bank, that were also stewards that cared about the community. The rise of heavily populated suburbs that offered no positive regional leadership, only a veto of everything and a sucking away of jobs from the central city. And the takeover of the Republican Party by the Christian Coalition, the LDS and national right-wing money. With it came the purges of what were once mainsteam GOP leaders, such as Sue Gerard and Sue Grace. Democrat Rep. Karan English was defeated by J.D. Hayworth. It turned out that Bill Clinton's victory in 1994 was a fluke. Arizona was not being moderated by its large population influx: The newcomers were turning it to the right. This only continued in the 2000s, the damage concealed by the housing bubble, but liberals and progressives leaving in disillusionment.

The month I spent in Phoenix did nothing to dispell this. One major civic leader told me of his conversation with a friend who was determined to vote for Brewer. Nothing he could say would dissuade this individual. And the person admitted to all of Brewer's disqualifying faults. I had a conversation with someone, a very nice person, who had come in the 1990s from the Midwest, and he talked about "home" constantly. It was clear he would vote for the right. It was also amazing how little he knew, although he would vote. I got the sense his megachurch was helping him in election decisions. Yet he was frustrated that we didn't have commuter rail to his suburb. When another person talked about the great train service in Europe and the pleasure of living there, the conservative said he had no interest in doing so. Had he ever been outside the U.S.? No. I had many such discouraging conversations. Inward-looking. Uneducated and hostile to learning. Lack of curiosity. Lack of diversity thanks to suburban soft apartheid. Smug behind those suburban walls. Saturated with right-wing media. Saturated with fear. Such is Arizona.

Thus, the logical question can't be answered. If you want to throw out the bums that hurt Arizona, the smug incumbents tied to the special interests...why are you determined to vote for them again? But, then, this is America's question, too.

Comments

[soleri]

It impresses many of us as odd that an economy based on making the rich richer and pauperizing everyone else could be championed by a major political party. It then confounds disbelief to think this party will be swept back into power during an economic calamity in which the rich have so monopolized wealth that virtually everyone else is demonstrably poorer. Bad memories, ubiquitous propaganda, and status anxiety can make idiots out of any electorate. Props to Arizona for getting there first.

While Arizona has its own peculiar set of circumstances, imagine Ohio where deindustrialization has devastated the economy. If you thought there might be a groundswell of populism, you'd be wrong (unless that populism is of the völkisch variety). Champions of free trade, tax cuts for the rich, and deregulation are favorites to win the governorship and US senator election.

I don't think a republic can survive when one of its two major political parties has been captured by nihilists. The Republican captivity isn't merely the lumpenprole sort of thuggishness you'd expect from Limbaugh, Beck, and O'Reilly. It goes up the food chain to people like David Brooks, Jon Kyl, Mort Zuckerman, and John McCain. It even has a patina of respectability that disguises a deep and disturbing cynicism about public life and integrity.

A country that is as divorced from reality as this one has a dangerous wobble in its gyroscope. We go to war based on lies and revenge. We lie to ourselves about a capricious and rapacious health-care system. We find a way to blame the least powerful citizens for the depredations of the most powerful (re: minorities causing the housing bubble). And there's no longer a dominant consensus reality that buffers the extremist nonsense coming from far right field.

At this point, it's worth asking how much longer democracy (such as it is) survives here. I'm too pessimistic to even want to guess.

[Jacob]

Re: "the campesino mindset of the Mexican-American population that doesn't vote"

You spend a lot of time bashing the white-right voting bloc, but very little time bashing the brown-right voting bloc. Should we be surprised that under-educated people of any race vote against their own interests?

And would it kill the DNC to invest a little cash into organizing the local Mexican-American population?

[Wally Pip]

It's all tribalism, like the Red Sox and Yankees. If you're a Sox fan, you hate each and every Yankee who's ever donned the pinstripes. And you want the Yankees to lose no matter what, even if your Sox aren't winning. This mindset has infected and subsumed modern governance. My team, right or wrong, and a pox on everyone else.

Remember it was Goldwater who told Nixon he had to go, or he would be impeached. If presented with a similar scenario -- actually they could have been and should have been on several fronts -- who among the current GOP leadership would have gone to George W. Bush to tell him the gig was up? Nobody.

So the U.S. routinely violates its Constitution and treaties, and corporations make no pretense about running the show.

Fewer and fewer Americans are prospering, but few of them understand why.

Remember when Carl Bernstein wrote his essay denouncing our "idiot culture?" It's rise has only hastened.

I am encouraging my children to consider relocating to a nation that still offers democracy.

[Jim Hamblin]

Sam Walton proved that one should not underestimate the ongoing stupidification of John Q. Public.
Certainly this is not politically correct but unfortunately it is proving to be all too true.

[Stoopid]

"the ongoing stupidification of John Q. Public" - Jim Hamblin

Me think its spelt 'stoopidficashun'.

[Jim]

From a trusted source, I learned that the state Democratic Party commissioned focus groups on who will vote for what candidate. They were surprised to learn that low to moderate income female Democrats saw Governor Brewer in a favorable light. She's up from the bootstraps. Scrappy. A fighter.

But what about the issues that concern you, pollsters asked? Nope. Really doesn't matter. She's up from the bootstraps. Scrappy. A fighter.

Will those impressions translate to actual cross-over votes on Election Day? We shall see.

[Now in New England]

Very depressing, but probably true. Arizona is doomed.... Are the rest of us too?

[phxSUNSfan]

There have been a couple of contributors to the past two conversations on Rogue that have concerned me! Their opinions are pure inanity and insanity!

"I am encouraging my children to consider relocating to a nation that still offers democracy."

This statement gives me great pause as I witness the witless denounce their country and turn their backs on a good fight to right the ship. Instead of encouraging your children to leave maybe you should encourage them to contribute to society. Teach them their civic duties of being a part of the electorate.

AND this: "Simply put, the Chinese won't tolerate the freedom to amp up and broadcast nonsense. And I say: Good on them. Who in the hell needs that kind of freedom?"

An admiration for China's ability to silence critics (however wrong their opinions) and to not give people (including the media) a right to speak! Are you kidding me? Leftist radicalism is no better than the right and I hope these sentiments are not widespread. It is equivalent to Russell Pearce's quest to amend the 14th Amendment! Both un-American to me...

As for Arizona, there is still hope that Terry Goddard will be the victor in this race. He has been closing in on the befuddled Governor Brewer for some time. I do agree that there are those who, despite Brewer's lack of intelligence and leadership, will vote for her no matter what.

I hope the moderate and democratic voters turn out in strong numbers Nov. 2 as it is the only hope for Goddard and for the future of Arizona. I believe it is more complicated than the sports fan comparison to Red Sox/Yankee fans, even to group the "Mexican-American" contingency into one group is wrongheaded and leaves out dynamic differences within the community.

Recent poles have shown, most notably in Colorado, that "Mexican-Americans" overwhelming approve of SB 1070 by a wide majority (greater than 60%). Generational differences can be great within this community and very much highlights resentments that even exist within Mexico regarding class, skin color, and "pedigree". Relying on any Hispanic to be a Democrat is not very wise.

On the bright side, many people I've spoken to about these issues are smart enough to realize they do not have to vote along party lines and can have conservative values but know when moderation is necessary. They can vote for Goddard realizing that Brewer is in over her head and still call themselves Republican. For some reason I get the impression that many moderate Republicans fear being called RINOs which is a ridiculous cavil the Tea Party uses to malign Republicans they disagree with (Goldwater would most definitely be considered a RINO today by many "nihilist Republicans").

[Donna Gratehouse]

Jim, Democrats in Arizona, according to the latest DailyKos Public Policy Polling Survey, are going for Goddard 85 to 11%. Democratic voters favor Jan Brewer at 16%, compared to 76% unfavorable. Her opinion among self-described moderates is 32% favorable to 60% unfavorable.

http://www.dailykos.com/polling/2010/10/23/AZ/18/i8kAz

She may well win, but it won't be because she won over Democrats of either gender. She'll win because of a large bloc of conservatives and because they've bamboozled enough moderates and independents to support her. If she were putting her social conservative and rah rah everyone-should-be-able-to-carry-a-gun-absolutely-anywhere views at the forefront, she'd be looking at Len Munsil 2.0 numbers.

But no, her handlers have her running as a moderate. And it's working.

Democrats, send out an ad informing women voters of how Brewer signed bills allowing guns in bars and concealed carry without a permit.

[Rate Crimes]

"Another shot to the foot" - Rogue

What damage will be done by the accidental bullet if the proverbial state's proverbial foot is lodged firmly in its mouth?

[ChrisInDenver]

I remember Burton Barr running for governor in 1986 when I was a little boy in Phoenix. Mr. Talton's column jogged my memory a bit -- especially the part about Barr and Alfredo Gutierrez working together on issues, despite their political differences -- so I decided to do a little reading about him.
I found a proclamation issued by the Arizona Legislature after Mr. Barr's death in Jan. 1997, lauding him for his ability to get things done as a legislator, and for his willingness to compromise on the issues. Mr. Barr's fellow lawmakers nicknamed him "Mr. Magic." Here's an excerpt from the proclamation:
"Burton Barr represented north central Phoenix in the Arizona House of Representatives for twenty-two years from 1964 to 1986. He was the Republican majority leader for twenty of those years. It is said that Mr. Barr was involved in some way in every major piece of legislation during his distinguished tenure. Vehicle inspection, health care for indigents, school aid, the tax code, prison reform, child care, groundwater management and freeway funding are a few of his many accomplishments. According to Burton Barr: 'We operated on a thesis that we wanted to do things.'"
It is stunning how different the Arizona Legislature is today. There is no compromising there. Republicans are not willing to work with Democrats, and vice-versa. And God forbid if a Republican favors a bill that extends healthcare to indigents, or funds schools properly. How is it that in just over a decade, Arizona has become such an extreme state?

[soleri]

Chris, the difference between today and the 1980s is the magnification of the Culture War in right-wing politics. What started out as a somewhat shadowy way of mobilizing base voters eventually took over the entire enterprise. This set of tactics was so successful that it turned the Republican Party into a wing of its own media. That's why a Rush Limbaugh is the de facto leader of the GOP. This is unprecedented in American history. The Id supplanted the Ego in Republican politics.

[ChrisInDenver]

Thanks, Soleri. You and Emil always do a great job of explaining things.

[Rate Crimes]

"the difference between today and the 1980s is the magnification of the Culture War in right-wing politics."- soleri.

True, but in the world where politics is a mere reflection of the reality that all things come down to energy, the perspective is more raw. Nuclear energy was all very new in the 80s, and oil was in temporary surfeit after the world readjusted to the U.S. peak production in the early 70s.

Now that the real costs of nuclear, coal, gas, and oil are becoming apparent, while the production from Cantarell and the North Sea wane, the lizard core of our collective and individual brains is beginning to react.

[soleri]

Rate Crimes, I agree with your idea that we're suffering a kind of collective anxiety attack because of diminishing prosperity (with energy being the key factor). James Kunstler writes about this subject as it relates to suburban expansionism and the inevitable limits that Peak Oil has already begun to set. But then you have to ask why the American right is so keen to deny these limits. Obviously, its corporate overlords have their own interests, but how does the white working class benefit from their self dealing?

I think a major part of the answer is the the Culture War itself. Explanations are like narcotics, and the simpler ones are virtual heroin. By positing an imaginary Eden (say, 1950s America), right-wing propagandists make an enemy of modernism itself. We can vote ourselves back to paradise! Clearly, this is delusional, which is why the policy prescriptions on the right tend to belief-based dogma and even fantasy.

[Rate Crimes]

Agreed, Soleri! However, fantasy is a higher-brain function. I still hold to the theory that it's the vestigal lizard id that's most at work on the other side of the cultural wall.

[phxSUNSfan]

Rate Crimes, I don't think it's some "vestigial lizard id" that is afflicting the right as I'm assuming President Obama was alluding to as well.

I think this has more to do with a new American laziness that manifests itself in our public education system as well. We humans are wired to think more complex than lizards and dogs. We know there is a problem, but we are too lazy to think through it ourselves and therefore let others think for the "collective."

There may be some fear of the unknown involved but the ability to solve problems is an issue for many Americans today. Even in the leftist camp; therefore, much of the political rhetoric of the day sounds like a fight or flight response.

Even here we've read of those fearful enough from the left to want to leave the country or forfeit rights in order to feel safer or to silence those they disagree with.

[azrebel]

I'm reading a book about the history of the Arizona area. It looks like all the problems we face started when Man first arrived in the area. Prior to that everything seemed pretty good.

The lizards and their Ids had it quite good.

[phxSUNSfan]

Man or "Western Man," azrebel?

[azrebel]

Man.

Lizards were having a 350,000,000 year party until the first man showed up and was heard to say, "hey, I wonder if that's edible?"

[phxSUNSfan]

LOL!

[terry dudas]

This stream is a hoot!!

[Sycamore]

Count me among the "liberals" who threw up their arms and left AZ, after living there for 18 years, in 2003. Like Jon, it still tugs at me, and I will visit my parents in Prescott in a couple of weeks; I expect (as always) to be thoroughly despaired by the destruction that I see out my window on the drive up from PHX.

Before moving, we lived in Ashland Place, a tiny bastion of livability right off of Central. I was happy as long as 1) it wasn't one of the eight months of summer; and 2) I didn't venture out of our part of town -- the bleak "urbanity" of the rest of the metro area just made me sad.

We now live in Portland and love it. Most of it, anyway. In OR we have what seems to me a dreadful choice in the governor's race this time. My wife and I were just talking this evening and she asked me who I would vote for. I openly criticize those that vote on party lines alone, but I find myself struggling with the fact that I vote for Democrats only because they aren't Republican. Climate change is my lead issue, and apparently no GOP candidates believe that it is human-caused......so......after lamenting that the days of the Teddy Roosevelt (and the like) GOP are long gone, I will grit my teeth to some degree next week (we vote by mail) and go all "D".......

A meandering post, but I've been "lurking" on the site for a time and wanted to contribute........

[ChrisInDenver]

Sycamore, an excellent contribution. Thanks for your input. I, too, am one of the so-called "liberal voters" who spent years in Arizona but left a few years ago. I was actually born in AZ and lived there for the first 27 years of my life, but after graduating college in 2000 and spending more than a year looking for a decent job in journalism, I realized, the pastures must be greener elsewhere. Indeed, they are. If I hadn't left in 2004, who knows -- I might still be waiting tables in Scottsdale.
Yeah, I miss Arizona terribly, but I'm much happier in Denver.

[CDT]

It's not that complicated. For a generation the middle class has been under attack. The Democrats were elected to do something about that, and have squandered the opportunity. The voting populace is suffering from a collective rage, and I don't blame them. Obama has managed to ruin the prospects for progressive change for another generation, without actually being a liberal.

[phxSUNSfan]

CDT, I would agree with you if the extreme political ideology didn't exist with this shift to the FAR right (so it seems).

It doesn't explain the radical shift since 2008 with Republicans and many Independents (particularly of the Tea Party element).

[Rate Crimes]

Sycamore, thanks for commiserating. After living in and around Phx, AZ for almost two decades, I was given the revelations of SF, Portland, Seattle, Vancouver BC, etc; about five years after getting my first inkling that Scottsdale is a Potyomkin village fronting hell.

I will always remember my first visit to Portland. Within a few hours of my arrival on a visit to friends, we were taking a late evening walk through neighborhoods of beautiful, old houses on wooded streets whose intersections were works of art. A few blocks later, I was getting naked to jump into a beautiful, large backyard cob(!) sauna with a dozen welcoming strangers. It was a perfect way to wash away the bitter dust of hell.

[Jim Hamblin]

We ask how Arizona took such a sudden lurch to the right. Jon reminds us that one large factor is the huge influx of bedrock conservative (and sometimes backward) Midwesterners. Who knows where the moderates and the progressives go?

[Petro]

Tip O' The Hat, from Portland, to the other AZ "ex-pats" in this thread.

[Rate Crimes]

"the huge influx of bedrock conservative Midwesterners." - Jim Hamblin.

I came to AZ from the Midwest in the early 90s. I knew nothing of Arizona's history or culture; political or otherwise. I did know enough to not vote for Symington. I only wish I had sooner understood that Symington was a symptom of a profound and fundamental Arizona ill.

A regression analysis is necessary before we attribute the emigration point of its newer citizens as the primary factor that distorts Arizona's culture. One can think of several other standard demographic factors that could be just as, or more important: age, sex, income, family, etc.

I think that Arizona's problems have more to do with the stories our culture has been telling itself over the past half-century, and the circumstance of Arizona as a diminutive, vestigial frontier remnant where the vintage tales collide destructively with more recent myths. Arizona is now a battered, distressed, schizophrenic witness to this clash of titanic delusions.

Blaming Midwesterners may be a too convenient symptom of a communal post-traumatic stress disorder.

[Pete]

Jon,

I was wondering. Would you say that the Phoenix area (Maricopa County) is almost like Orange County in the desert. It reminds me a lot of the area. You have Santa Ana which is heavily hispanic and has a lot of gangs and is comparable to West Phoenix. Mission Viejo, Lake Forest is similar to Scottsdale/Paradise Valley. Sheriff Carona (the guy that got thrown in jail) is similar to Arpaio.

Also, both areas started experiencing breakneck growth in the 1950s and both were kind of seen as havens away from big city life and the whole "lets try to replicate our small town midwest disney lifestyle". Its no coincidence that Disney built Disneyworld in Orange County. The difference is that by both counties have more than three million people. But does that make Santa Ana or Phoenix a big city and in the same conversation as Chicago or Boston? No, because they are nothing more than one giant suburb.

[Jim Hamblin]

At the risk of belaboring the critique of Midwestern migration and its effect on the Valley, I'm one of them . . . albeit from the 60's. That was long before there was a huge surge. Living in Fountain Hills, largely an enclave of folks from the Heartland, I'm keenly aware of the bedrock values present just below the surface. Some are commendable (like honesty and fair play) and others are questionable (like certain prejudices and political calcification) . . . on balance, the influence is not particularly forward-looking.

[Rate Crimes]

I believe that "Midwestern values", as recognized/stereotyped in AZ, rather than being an essential feature of Midwesterners, are more likely a result of the predominance of immigrants to AZ from that region, combined with numerous other salient factors that are particular to the segment of people who choose to emigrate from there. The pre-existing, self-reinforcing, magnifying, and/or exacerbating aspects of Arizona's established culture must also be included in any analysis.

In other words, it ain't so much that they're from Iowa, it's that they have the personality, the means, the desire, and the heart, to live in places like Fountain Hills, Phoenix, Scottsdale, etc. that makes them the Arizonians they are.

[azrebel]

It is said that hate IS NOT the opposite of love. Indifference IS the opposite of love.

Other than a small vocal minority on both sides of most issues that make the news here in AZ, it is the vast population of people "who just don't care" about the plight of various groups. As Jon has described, secluded in their walled and gated enclaves, they just don't care. AND, they really don't appreciate having subjects pushed in front of them that they have no desire to care about. It's kind of funny because they really care about what's going on "back home". They'll even follow the exploits of high schools that they attended decades ago, but could care less about education here. The bad thing for us natives is that these uncaring permanent/visitors feel the need to vote on issues they have no concern for. That makes for a weird outcome. They vote with their midwest brains on western issues. That would be like us getting to vote on a gas pipeline through Oregon providing gas to northern California. We would be clueless about the ramifications and we could care less about the outcome. But BOY, we could walk around with our chests sticking out and procaliming that we did our civic duty and voted.

P.S. I ain't picking on midwesterners only. This post applies to all the dang Californicators who moved here in the last decade as well. Anyone who moved here in the last 50 years, this post is for you. I'm an equal opportunity poster.

[Jim Hamblin]

Footnote: we belong to a good sized organization where at least 40% of the members are seasonal residents. Many have not returned yet and it is almost the first of November! Maybe I've been oblivious to this until now, but it seems to be a growing trend that feeds the sense of detachment and political ignorance. As the area grows hotter, we could be looking at an even shorter "season".

[azrebel]

Jim, it has been my observation that the southern migration revolves around Thankgiving and the northern migration revolves around April tax day. Temperature may also impact the migration a few weeks one way or the other.

[phxSUNSfan]

As I've stated before, my family is native to Arizona and I agree that most of our weird political extremists are from other regions of the nation. Those "displaced" by the ultra-liberal vibe in California have made their way here and are a small minority of LOUD right-wingers, screaming to ensure anti-Californication.

The same is true for mid-westerners whom have seen gay marriage become legal in Iowa and their little cities become quasi gay meccas (Minneapolis). They come here hoping to live in a bubble destroying our cultural heritage instead of embracing it. They also misconstrue the "live-let-live" motto that long dominated the "frontier."

The Republicans I remember and read about in Arizona's past are not like those that have emigrated here recently. Even as a youth visiting my abuela in the 90's I started recognizing the difference.

When she was alive, my grandmother had many Anglo friends (late 60's - 80 years of age) who would converse about topics with her in English and Spanish. As those friends started to pass the new old folk from Wisconsin resisted that type of cultural mix: "This is America, Speak English please!"

I still believe that the moderate and "friendly" outnumber those emigrants who fear diversity because of their vocal protests. Thus the natives feel overwhelmed.

If we fight back, and dare I say, WE take back Arizona (LOL) then we'd see a return to sanity and an embrace of our cultural heritage.

I've convinced my 84 year old aunt to vote again because she felt it didn't matter because of all the new people. But I beg to differ...

[phxSUNSfan]

Correction: "I still believe that the moderate and 'friendly' outnumber those emigrants who fear diversity because of their vocal protests. Thus the natives feel overwhelmed."

This is confusing, what I meant to write is this:

I still believe that the moderate and "friendly" outnumber those emigrants who fear diversity. But because of those emigrants vocal protests, the natives feel overwhelmed and outnumbered.

[azrebel]

phxSUNfan notes "live and let live" motto of the frontier.

I am currently reading a history of AZ and the motto was more like "Die and let die". The southwest was a rough place, even up to the turn of the last century (1900). Whites. Indians (multiple tribes). Mexicans. Texans. Mormons. If there was a disagreement, it was usually settled with a massacre of everyone, women and children included. Due to our longevity, we are only two generations removed from the last Indian wars. I believe that genetically us southwesterners still need space and we don't like being crowded. It makes us cranky.

[phxSUNSfan]

AZrebel, I agree with the the gun slinging cowboy era you speak of existed, but when much of that gave way to the community building embraced in the late 1800's and more notably the 1910's (statehood) things started to change.

I don't remember a crankiness to the southwestern lifestyle at all. I remember the town fiestas from Tolleson to Safford, Flagstaff to Sierra Vista and the mix of cultures revolving around those community events.

I know I am romanticizing a little, but there was a vivid and noticeable mix of races and cultures in the 80's and 90's that I remember. I see that mix returning sporadically throughout the metro (most notably the Central City and even Glendale).

Parts of the West Valley have surprised me with their vibrancy and why I remain optimistic. The Arab Festival in Central Phoenix is another sign that many, many Arizonans are NOT closed minded nor backward.

[phxSUNSfan]

Ooops, another correction:

It is not the Arab Festival but the Arab American Festival: http://arabamericanfestival.com/index.php

[eclecticdog]

I don't think the Frontier or early statehood AZ was all that great. Regular massacres of Indians, and a strict structure of race separation. The AZ Rangers were regularly used to break strikes in AZ and Old Mexico. So Blue Dog Demos (to use a modern term) are replaced by Repubs after the midwestern migration to AZ after WWII.

I think now our thinking is completely distorted by the 1950s -- a time in the USA of unparalled power, prestige, industry, and social change, but a complete ahistorical blip that people wax nostalgic over like it was always that way (and not all of it was pretty - think of the end of segregation). We have bought the myth and think it was always that way.

[phxSUNSfan]

EC, there is a nostalgia surrounding the 1950's, but that was markedly different from the cultural being of Arizona. Especially from the times I speak of. I am not referring to some misguided "Eden" as someone alluded to when all were white and right, but to a palpable and real society that existed in my young lifetime.

I'm not unaware of the difficulty my grandmother faced in the 30's, and 40's and beyond but even she had stories of a time when community was embraced...even among the whites, Indios and Mexicans.

When a shared commitment to the land and to the future existed. What I'm stating is the building of that past into a more inclusive society and not that it existed perfectly in that time.

[Rogue Columnist]

Great conversation.

Pete, metro Phoenix is very unlike Orange County in most ways. Among them: OC has very high incomes; a diverse, high-quality economy (e.g, Irvine Ranch); a UC branch; the ocean, and, most of all, proximity to Los Angeles, a world city.

[Rate Crimes]

"most of all, proximity to Los Angeles, a world city." - Rogue

deep water port

[phxSUNSfan]

If the electorate show up in Arizona, and Goddard becomes Governor, then Arizona's chance of having one of the largest, if not the largest, "inland ports" linked to the Mexican coast in Baja California will come to fruition much more quickly. A port connected via rail: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/06/13/20100613arizona-growth-inland-port.html

[phxSUNSfan]

Forgot to note, the only thing I would be against is another proposed interstate (I-11) connecting Metro Phoenix to Vegas. Instead I'd like to see that commerce moved via train and using cleaner during freight trucks on existing interstates. Isn't that why the Mike O'Callaghan - Pat Tillman Memorial Bridge was constructed in the first place?

[azrebel]

The O'Callaghan - Tillman bridge was built to give me nightmares. I'll cross it as soon as they lower it 900 ft.

[phxSUNSfan]

AZrebel, that's no fun... :-)

[azrebel]

If God had wanted a bridge 900 feet in the air, he would have put a 900 foot hill under it. It isn't the fall that kills you, it's the landing.